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Comparison of rakes

From:   Hank Youngerman
Address:   redtop@redtopbg.com
Date:   18 October 2005
Subject:   Rake Comparison
Forum:   rec.games.backgammon
Google:   r4v8l1h5tqsv9hv0j1sa1vu63ckitdantl@4ax.com

I did a rake comparison between ClubGames, TrueMoneyGames, and
GammonEmpire.  If I made a mistake, don't shoot me.  I assumed 2.2
points per money game and used GammonEmpire's standard rake.  Yes, i
know they have lower rakes for some ratings situations and higher
rakes for others.

It is not even worth comparing GE rakes.  They generally run 20-100%
higher than the competition.  If you don't want to go broke fast, you
better be an over-1700 player playing other over-1700's.

CG is generally lower than TMG.  CG is 4-40% higher for money games,
depending on stake, but for matches CG is as much as 30% lower.  TMG
is lower for short (1-3 pt), high-stakes matches.

If I made a mistake, please tell me politely, don't flame me.


Money Game
         CG      TMG      GE
$2       0.22    0.21     0.43
$10      1.10    0.88     2.16
$25      2.75    1.98     4.29
$100     6.00    5.28    12.76

Match pts:  1
$2       0.10    0.15     0.16
$10      0.50    0.66     0.78
$25      1.25    1.55     1.70
$100     5.00    4.20     5.80

Match pts:  3
$2       0.14    0.17     0.18
$10      0.70    0.76     0.88
$25      1.75    1.80     1.95
$100     6.00    5.20     6.80

Match pts:  5
$2       0.14    0.19     0.20
$10      0.70    0.86     0.98
$25      1.75    2.05     2.20
$100     6.00    6.20     7.80

Match pts:  11
$2       0.18    0.23     0.26
$10      0.90    1.06     1.28
$25      2.25    2.55     2.95
$100     6.00    8.20    10.80

Paul Epstein  writes:

Thank you very much for this valuable information.

I'd be interested to know what your reasons are for leaving Gamesgrid
out of the analysis.

Hank Youngerman  writes:

My reasons for omitting GamesGrid were:

a) It requires a monthly membership fee.  Very frequent money players
may get time added to their membership.  I don't know the exact
details of how much rake you have to pay to get free time, but based
on my own (limited) experience you have to play quite a lot

b) The money play model on GG is very different.  They have no
tournaments other than 4-player Jackpots (same as Sit-N-Go's) except
that I think they have a web-based tournament once a month, and for
money games you have to hunt up an opponent.

Raccoon  writes:

Estimating the average value of a money game at 2.3 (and ignoring the
very small effect of the TMG 8-point rake cap and the CG $6 per player
cap):

TOTAL AMOUNT RAKED BY THE HOUSE PER AVERAGE MONEY GAME

Stake   Gamesgrid  Next Best Site
  $1     $0.08      $0.12 (TMG and CG)
  $2     $0.16      $0.23 (TMG and CG)
  $3     $0.24      $0.32 (TMG)
 $10     $0.30      $0.92 (TMG)
 $20     $0.50      $1.66 (TMG)
 $50     $0.80      $3.45 (TMG)
$100     $0.80      $5.52 (TMG)

Thanks for posting your review, by the way. Mine got sidetracked :-

Grunty  writes:

Worth mentioning GG has a membership fee around $10 per month.
At medium/high stakes this may be meaningless.
The other sites don't charge any fee.

Raccoon  writes:

I had started a review of online rakes weeks ago, but then GE/P65
raised their rake, and then TMG lowered theirs, and then Hank
Youngerman posted a short review of three sites ... anyway, here it is.

Below is a comparison of the rake -- the house fee -- at four online
backgammon sites for money sessions (money games) and match play for
money:

Gammonempire/Play65 (GE/P65)
TrueMoneygames (TMG)
Gamesgrid (GG)
ClubGames (CG)

This data is based on the information presented on the online sites'
webpages as of 18 October 2005.  Correction of errors -- mine or theirs
-- is welcome.

GE/P65, TMG and GG are the largest online backgammon sites that offer
money games and matches; CG is new. GE and P65 are "skins" that lead to
the same server. TMG is also part of a network of skins but I do not
have a complete list of all the other skins.

All the sites' published rakes are PER PLAYER. In the Money Game tables
below, the rake shown is the TOTAL DOLLAR AMOUNT RAKED per game, i.e.,
twice the per player amount. In the Match tables, the rake is shown as
a percentage; See Note 3. For GE/P65, two rakes are listed. The rakes
in the column headed "Ge/P65 rake (1700)" ONLY applies when BOTH
players are rated over 1700 (see Note 2).

WHICH SITE IS THE BEST TO PLAY AT?

This article endorses no site and does not discuss graphics, security,
support, popularity, membership fees, bonuses, ease of finding an
opponent, flexibility in setting match conditions or other features
users may consider important. There is also no information here on
money tournaments, freerolls and SNGs. If your goal is to play
backgammon profitably then the best site for you is the one on which
you are most successful in finding opponents who play worse than you do
-- and beating them. That site may not be the one with the lowest rake.

WHICH SITE HAS THE BEST RAKE FOR MONEY GAMES?

Gamesgrid, which rakes PER GAME, not PER POINT, has by far the lowest
rake. In the Money Game tables the most important line is the one for
"average game," for which an average money game has a value of 2.3
points. See Note 1.

Next best is: TMG and CG for $1-$2 per point, TMG for $3-$50 per point,
and either TMG or CG (because of CG's $6 rake cap) for $100 per point.
GE/P65's rake  is competitive only for players rated over 1700.

$1 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $0.12    $0.12   $0.08   $0.23       $0.11

 1 pt game    $0.05    $0.05   $0.08   $0.10       $0.05
 2 pt game    $0.10    $0.10   $0.08   $0.20       $0.10
 4 pt game    $0.20    $0.20   $0.08   $0.39       $0.20
 8 pt game    $0.40    $0.40   $0.08   $0.78       $0.39
16 pt game    $0.40    $0.80   $0.08   $1.56       $0.78

$2 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $0.23    $0.23   $0.16   $0.45       $0.23

 1 pt game    $0.10    $0.10   $0.16   $0.20       $0.10
 2 pt game    $0.19    $0.20   $0.16   $0.39       $0.20
 4 pt game    $0.38    $0.40   $0.16   $0.78       $0.39
 8 pt game    $0.77    $0.80   $0.16   $1.57       $0.78
16 pt game    $0.77    $1.60   $0.16   $3.14       $1.57

$3 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $0.32    $0.35   $0.24   $0.68       $0.34

 1 pt game    $0.14    $0.15   $0.24   $0.29       $0.15
 2 pt game    $0.28    $0.30   $0.24   $0.59       $0.29
 4 pt game    $0.56    $0.60   $0.24   $1.18       $0.59
 8 pt game    $1.10    $1.20   $0.24   $2.35       $1.18
16 pt game    $1.10    $2.40   $0.24   $4.70       $2.35

$10 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $0.92    $1.15   $0.30   $2.25       $1.13

 1 pt game    $0.40    $0.50   $0.30   $0.98       $0.49
 2 pt game    $0.80    $1.00   $0.30   $1.96       $0.98
 4 pt game    $1.60    $2.00   $0.30   $3.92       $1.96
 8 pt game    $3.20    $4.00   $0.30   $7.84       $3.92
16 pt game    $3.20    $6.00   $0.30  $15.68       $5.00

$20 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $1.66    $2.30   $0.50   $3.59       $1.79

 1 pt game    $0.72    $1.00   $0.50   $1.56       $0.78

 2 pt game    $1.44    $2.00   $0.50   $3.12       $1.56
 4 pt game    $2.88    $4.00   $0.50   $6.24       $3.12
 8 pt game    $5.76    $6.00   $0.50  $12.48       $5.00
16 pt game    $5.76    $6.00   $0.50  $24.96       $5.00

$50 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $3.45    $5.75   $0.80   $8.97       $4.49

 1 pt game    $1.50    $2.50   $0.80   $3.90       $1.95

 2 pt game    $3.00    $5.00   $0.80   $7.80       $3.90
 4 pt game    $6.00    $6.00   $0.80  $15.60       $5.00
 8 pt game   $12.00    $6.00   $0.80  $31.20       $5.00
16 pt game   $12.00    $6.00   $0.80  $62.40       $5.00

$100 per point:
Cube level   TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)

average game  $5.52    $6.00   $0.80  $17.94       $5.00

 1 pt game    $2.40    $5.00   $0.80   $7.80       $3.90
 2 pt game    $4.80    $6.00   $0.80  $15.60       $5.00
 4 pt game    $9.60    $6.00   $0.80  $31.20       $5.00
 8 pt game   $19.20    $6.00   $0.80  $62.40       $5.00
16 pt game   $19.20    $6.00   $0.80 $124.80       $5.00

WHICH SITE HAS THE BEST RAKE FOR MATCH PLAY?

For match play, CG seems lowest overall. GE/P65 has lower rakes only
for players rated over 1700 (see note 2 below). GG or TMG have lower
rakes at particular stake and match length combinations. TMG's
effective rake is actually a little lower than the percentages shown
here; note 3 explains why.

To calculate the total house rake on a match, double the stake and
apply the rake percentage, e.g., the rake on a $50 match to 1 point is
$2.40 on TMG, $2.50 on CG, $0.80 on GG, and either $3.40 or $1.70 or as
much as $10.20 on GE/P65.

Match length: 1

Stake        TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)
  $1          3.7%     2.5%    3.9%    3.9%        1.95%
  $2          3.7%     2.5     3.9%    3.9%        1.95%

  $3          3.7%     2.5%    3.3%    3.9%        1.95%
 $10          3.3%     2.5%    1%      3.9%        1.95%
 $20          3.1%     2.5%    1.25%   3.4%        1.7%
 $50          2.4%     2.5%    0.8%    3.4%        1.7%
$100          2.1%     2.5%    0.4%    2.9%        1.45%

Match length: 3

Stake        TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)
  $1          4.2%     3.5%    3.9%    4.4%        2.2%
  $2          4.2%     3.5%    3.9%    4.4%        2.2%
  $3          4.2%     3.5%    3.9%    4.4%        2.2%
 $10          3.8%     3.5%    3.0%    4.4%        2.2%
 $20          3.6%     3.5%    3.75%   3.9%        1.95%
 $50          2.9%     3.5%    2.4%    3.9%        1.95%
$100          2.6%     3.0%    1.2%    3.4%        1.7%

Match length: 5

Stake        TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)
  $1          4.7%     3.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
  $2          4.7%     3.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
  $3          4.7%     3.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
 $10          4.3%     3.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
 $20          4.1%     3.5%    3.9%    4.4%        2.2%
 $50          3.4%     3.5%    3.9%    4.4%        2.2%
$100          3.1%     3.0%    2.0%    3.9%        1.95%

Match length: 7
Stake        TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)
  $1          5.2%     4.5%    3.9%    5.4%        2.7%
  $2          5.2%     4.5%    3.9%    5.4%        2.7%
  $3          5.2%     4.5%    3.9%    5.4%        2.7%
 $10          4.8%     4.5%    3.9%    5.4%        2.7%
 $20          4.6%     4.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
 $50          3.9%     4.5%    3.9%    4.9%        2.45%
$100          3.6%     3.0%    2.0%    4.4%        2.2%

Match length: 11
Stake        TMG rake CG rake GG rake GE/P65 rake GE/P65 rake (1700)
  $1          5.7%     4.5%    3.9%    6.4%        3.2%
  $2          5.7%     4.5%    3.9%    6.4%        3.2%
  $3          5.7%     4.5%    3.9%    6.4%        3.2%
 $10          5.3%     4.5%    3.9%    6.4%        3.2%
 $20          5.1%     4.5%    3.9%    5.9%        2.95%
 $50          4.4%     4.5%    3.9%    5.9%        2.95%
$100          4.1%     3.0%    3.9%    5.4%        2.5%

Notes:

1) In money game sessions (not matches) GG charges rake per GAME. The
other servers charge per POINT at stake. On GG the rake is the same
every game without regard to cube value or gammons. On the other
servers the rake doubles and redoubles along with the value of the cube
up to a maximum, if any (on TMG the rake is capped at 8 points; on
ClubGames, it's capped at $6 per player).

So, in order to compare rakes, we need to know how much an average
money game is worth. There is not much evidence of the average game
value in games between average human players but we can get an idea
from computer simulations. These tables assume an average money game is
worth 2.3 points (which I think is low --

the online sites know for sure, if they keep track of that data).

We should also know how the maximum rake cap of 8 points on
TrueMoneygames, $6.00 per player on ClubGames and $5.00 per player on
Gammonempire/Play65 (but only if both players are rated over 1650)
effects the average rake. Unfortunately that is not calculable unless
we know what percentage of games are affected by the cap, but it seems
clear that the effect is in any case very small for stakes below $50.

2) GE/Play65 has a complicated rake schedule. If and only if both
players are rated over 1700, the rake is 50% of the standard rake; this
rake is shown above in the column furthest to the right. If and only if
both players are rated over 1650, the maximum rake per game or match is
$5.00 per player. This $5 cap is reflected in the "over 1700" column
but not in the other,  "standard rake" GE/P65 column. And be warned:
players whose ratings are not similar are charged rakes as much as
THREE TIMES the standard rake.

3) On most sites the rake is taken from the match stake; for example,
each player pays $50 for a $50 match and the rake is deducted from the
$100 wagered. But TMG adds the rake to the stake; for example, a $50
match to 3 on TMG is effectively a match to $51.45 with a $1.45 per
player deduction. Thus on TMG the effective rake on this match is 2.81%
(2.90 raked from $102.90), which is slightly better than the 2.9% rate
($2.90 raked on $100) that TMG advertises; and similarly, for other
match stakes/lengths.
 
Did you find the information in this article useful?          

Do you have any comments you'd like to add?     

 

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